My brain is crazy

[snick_backup]

Dream last night: I read an all-human AU. Of Spike/Dawn (does anyone even write those?). By nwhepcat. I said to myself, "Well, gee, if anyone could make me believe Spike/Dawn, she can." Alas, she could not. But I do now have an image of Dawn in a lovely Anya-style floral-print dress, and Spike in modern street punk clothes with spiky black gelled hair.

Comments

[pennydrdful.livejournal.com]

I've stumbled upon some Spike/Dawns fics that were good, wherein 'good' is defined as believable and in-character, if not exactly the most pleasant of things. Can't say I've ever read any all-human ones though. In fact, I would venture to say that Dawn typically doesn't show up in most all-human fics for whatever reason.

[bobthemole.livejournal.com]

I would venture to say that Dawn typically doesn't show up in most all-human fics for whatever reason.

That didn't hit me until you mentioned it! I wonder why that is. It can't be because "Dawn wouldn't exist without Buffy being the Slayer" because if Anya can be Buffy's sassy-and-sex-obsessed-bff, a world with Dawn can't be that much of a stretch.

I wonder if it has to do with the reason all-human AUs exist in the first place. Which admittedly I am unclear about. I can understand historical AUs which answer the question "What would these characters be like if they grew up with different social mores?" (plus "How can we put Buffy and Spike in pretty period attire?"). But placing them in the contemporary US just seems so...redundant.

[pennydrdful.livejournal.com]

I can't say why people write them, but as a fan of reading them, I will say that at least from a pro-Spuffy POV, it can be a refreshing, new way for the characters to meet and interact with one another in a context outside of the confines of Slayer vs Vampire.

Now, as for why Dawn wouldn't be included in an all human AU, I can only hypothesize, and again, this is coming from a big Spuffy reader, that Dawn doesn't serve quite the same purpose as she does in non-AU fics. In the regular Buffyverse, Dawn often serves as a device through which we get to see Spike's capability for love and kindness even though he's a soulless vampire. This can be an important part of establishing a relationship between Buffy and Spike. In an all-human fic, however, there's usually not a need to prove that Spike is actually capable of love, and thus, no Dawn.

At least, that's just a thought I had.

[bobthemole.livejournal.com]

That makes a lot of sense. I guess it also points out how limited Dawn's role is sometimes.

I'm more intrigued by this non-existent Spawn AU now - what role would she play if she weren't a foil for Spuffy?

[snickfic]

Maybe she's still the younger sister everyone passes over? Maybe Spike's the bad boy who's crushing on the older sister but gets distracted by Dawn. Maybe she's the sassy one with a mind of her own who's more willing to accept Spike's criminal foibles than her prissy older sister is.

I have no idea, actually. I don't read AH fics, so I'm pretty much shooting in the dark here. Yet somehow, I find the idea of Spawn AH mildly more intriguing than Spuffy AU. Huh.

[snickfic]

Oh, I know Spike/Dawn exists, and I even like one or two for other reasons, if not for the Spike/Dawn. (Specifically: Let the World Spin by wesleysgirl, which is both post-apocalyptic and road-trippy and thus makes up for the fact the Spike/Dawn relationship reads pretty much as it does in canon, only with sex.)

Are there AH fics of any pairing beside Spuffy? I don't even read those, but since Spuffy's my main pairing I've at least heard of them. Like, I would assume someone somewhere is writing AH Bangel, but I've never seen mention of it.

[pennydrdful.livejournal.com]

Are there AH fics of any pairing beside Spuffy?

Umm.. I would surely thing that there are. But honestly, I don't know. I very rarely venture beyond Spuffy, and I cannot recall ever stumbling upon a non-Spuffy AH.

[next_to_normal]

She occasionally turns up in the predictable role as Buffy's sister in Spuffy AH fics, though I've also seen her once or twice as Spike's sister and as Buffy's and/or Spike's daughter.

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

Hahahaha! WIN.

[snickfic]

I thought so. Except now I sort of want to read it, which is mildly disturbing.

[riccadonna.livejournal.com]

Weird. Have a chamomile tonight before you go to sleep.

[snickfic]

Heh. Maybe that's exactly what I need: herbal tea remedy.

[next_to_normal]

I... kind of want to read that, now. I don't even know why. In fact, now I'm kind of intrigued to read ANY AH fic that's not Spuffy, just because I hardly ever see them. Which is completely backwards, since I don't like AH even when it's my OTP, but maybe I'm just feeling contrary tonight.

[snickfic]

I know! I want to read it, too! Maybe it is contrariness. Sometimes, though, I just get hungry to read something besides the Spuffy, you know? The basic concerns and tropes of other ships are so different from each other that a visit from one to another is like a vacation to a foreign country.

[next_to_normal]

Yes! That's exactly it, lol. I do like reading other pairings, but don't do it enough to know the common tropes. And then I end up wondering things like whether or not other pairings have as much AH or, as goldenusagi was just talking about, whether other vampire pairings use claiming as much as Spuffy. It's like an academic interest, almost - anthropological study of other ships, lol.

[snickfic]

Yes! And I find myself wishing there were someone out there collecting hard data...

[next_to_normal]

Well, Gabs is our resident numbers girl....

[snickfic]

And she's out there reading every ship she can get her hands on! Hmm...

[next_to_normal]

We should tell her to take more extensive notes! And then compare them! With graphs!

[snickfic]

But some of this is very subjective, y'know. Like, if "I want you but I can't be with you because it would be wrong!" doesn't happen to be a theme, what are the themes that are big with, say, Giles/Buffy, Willow/Xander, Willow/Tara, etc? What are the tropes? (I know at least some of the B/G folks are big into the idea of a mystical Slayer/Watcher bond. Go figure.)

And then there's the question of how a quality the stuff is, and when the fic tends to be set. Does anyone but Spuffy write time travel? I suppose any ship with a vamp or with Giles has the potential...

There are just so many questions!

[next_to_normal]

I know at least some of the B/G folks are big into the idea of a mystical Slayer/Watcher bond. Go figure.

Huh. I'd never seen that before, possibly because I avoid B/G fic like the plague. With locusts.

Although the mystical bond is kinda-sorta canon. Remember Intervention, where Giles had to do the ritual to transfer guardianship of Buffy over to the spirit guide? That indicates some sort of connection, at least.

Does anyone but Spuffy write time travel? I suppose any ship with a vamp or with Giles has the potential...

Well, really, ANY ship has the potential for time travel. Your favorite couple gets magically transported to [fill in the time period] and must depend on each other to survive. If there's a vampire lover someone can meet as a human in the past, that's just a bonus. :)

I admit, I am more curious about the tropes for human/human couples, because none of the vampire lore that's so popular in Spuffy fic would apply. Like, do het fics deal with regular, run-of-the-mill pregnancies with the same frequency as Spuffy's mystical ones? How do people show they love each other if they can't bite each other and yell, "MINE!"? Is the sex still as fantastic, even without the slayer/vampire stamina?

[snickfic]

I admit, I am more curious about the tropes for human/human couples, because none of the vampire lore that's so popular in Spuffy fic would apply

Heh. Yeah. I have a feeling that pregnancy fics are a pan-pairing (and likely pan-fandom) predeliction. Certainly I've run across them for Buffy/Giles, Faith/Giles, Giles/Anya, Buffy/Xander, Willow/Xander, Faith/Xander - and I don't even read most of those pairings!

The mind-blowing element of sex in fiction depends more on how the sex is presented than the actual mechanics and physical limitations, I think. You can sexy up just about anyone (except maybe the Trio); it just takes a bit more creativity. Giles and Faith both have "experience," Anya has all that imagination and adventurousness, Willow has witchiness which is presumably way useful somehow... I feel like if you're determined to give your ship Teh Best Sex Ever, you will find a way.