So here's a thing about SPN

[snick_backup]

I love our boys, right? And the vast majority of the time they've got good intentions and solid motives, and what they do saves the day and a few people besides. In fact, they're really good at what they do. They're so good - at staying under the radar, at breaking and entering and forging ID's and sweet-talking whoever they need to - that even Andy Gallagher, who can "Obi-Wan" people into doing whatever he wants, is hardly more powerful than the Winchesters. Short of one particularly nasty demon and his hellish hordes, nothing keeps these guys down. They charm people into believing anything. People trust them implicitly on the slimmest of evidence.

Now, they're not going to rape the teenage girl who sneaks them into her bedroom to keep the ghosts away, and they're not betraying the stewardess's trust even when they slam her colleague on the floor and start splashing him with what looks like acid... but they could be. No one to stop them.

And that? Is very disturbing.

Comments

[bobthemole.livejournal.com]

So. Very. True.


They are good at pushing past people's boundaries. And as some-stuff-I-read-today suggests men are, on average, less likely than women to see that as a problem.

Egads, this is SUCH a Guy Show.

[rebcake.livejournal.com]

Well, yeah. They are honorable guys. But, these nasty demons that keep popping up? Don't they just sort of take the body/skills of anybody? Wouldn't the Winchesters wreak the worst havoc in the wrong hands?

Also, my understanding is that Ted Bundy could make people trust him after just a few minutes of acquaintance. Sometimes I want to roll back all these crazy social advances, such as people under the age of, oh, 35 or so going about unchaperoned...

[penny-lane-42.livejournal.com]

You are very right.

[silverusagi]

The sad thing is, I think only people who read a lot of feminist things and are aware of feminist issues are going to pick up on this. Because, let's face it, guys just don't see the threat in situations when they let anyone into their house for anything, and most of the writers are guys.

Related: I once remember reading a post about how the Winchesters get away with what they do because of white male privelege. If they were Black or Hispanic, people wouldn't believe that they're supposed to be where they say they are so easily. OTOH, if they were women, they'd have an even EASIER time, because no one thinks women can be problems.

[ghostyouknow27.livejournal.com]

You know, it doesn't bother me on SPN, just because it's so fantastical, and the boys *are* honorable.

But on cop shows? It *really* bothers me when they try to batter subjects before they call in lawyers/ use the Patriot Act to get personal information/skirt the edges of legality to catch someone and/or prove their guilt. I understand that a show in which suspects are arrested and immediately request a lawyer would be boring, but I don't like feeling that I'm supposed to root for people employing somewhat dirty tactics or think that The Patriot Act is helping me avoid rape.

[bobthemole.livejournal.com]

Nodding with you there. Like, whose side am I supposed to be on?

[ghostyouknow27.livejournal.com]

Obviously, we are supposed to side with the cop who just *knows* someone is guilty and bends the law like whoa to make sure he's put away. But I'm just going, "But what if your gut's wrong, dude! And even if it isn't, I'm not sure we should break the law to catch this guy!"

[snickfic]

SUCH a Guy Show. Yes, it is.

(Except for a lot of Dean's characterization, which seems to me in direct opposition to standard Guy Characterization. Actually, I expect true Guy Shows to spend a lot less time on character development in general than this one does.)

[snickfic]

But, these nasty demons that keep popping up? Don't they just sort of take the body/skills of anybody?

I'm actually pretty confused about why they haven't already possessed the Winchesters. It'd have been a whole lot easier to get the Colt that way than all this deal-making and other rigmarole.

But yes. Would not want them possessed or, even worse, more or less themselves but under some kind of evil guiding influence.

[snickfic]

*nods*

[snickfic]

The sad thing is, I think only people who read a lot of feminist things and are aware of feminist issues are going to pick up on this.

Maybe. I mean, I don't consider myself strongly feminist, but I do read a lot of stuff on LJ and so forth. OTOH, I had similar issues with Veronica's cavalier lying and violation of others' privacy on Veronica Mars. Possibly my law-abiding tendency just goes deeper than I realized. :)

OTOH, if they were women, they'd have an even EASIER time, because no one thinks women can be problems.

Then again, if they were women they'd have a lot of other new problems - less physical strength and stature, less intimidation factor when they needed one, less automatic respect, more hassling.

V. good point about the race thing, though.

[snickfic]

But on cop shows? It *really* bothers me when they try to batter subjects before they call in lawyers/ use the Patriot Act to get personal information/skirt the edges of legality to catch someone and/or prove their guilt.

Yes. We have laws for a reason, people! Because philosophically we actually think they're a good idea and should apply to everyone.

Hmph.

[silverusagi]

Then again, if they were women they'd have a lot of other new problems - less physical strength and stature, less intimidation factor when they needed one, less automatic respect, more hassling.

Well, maybe just one of them could be a girl. :) How about a brother and sister team who save people and hunt things?

[snickfic]

bobthemole and I were actually just talking about genderswap AU's, and how there are tons of them in Sherlock fandom but we hadn't really seen any in SPN fandom (not that either of us has looked very hard). Sounds like lots of fun to me, though. Maybe you need another AU project, hmm? :)

[silverusagi]

OMG, SPN is FULL of genderswap fics. Both of the "they've always been girls/one of them has always been a girl" type and the "turned into girls" type.

Though rather a lot of them tend to be Wincest, it seems.

ETA: And I have enough AU projects right now. :) I'm actually about to make a post about one.

[snickfic]

Yeah, we figured a whole lot of them would end up being Wincest, in which we are not interested. Sigh.